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MANIACS: NO VIOLATIONS COMMITTED

Published: Wednesday, October 21, 2009

Updated: Saturday, October 24, 2009 04:10

Payne

Fans in “No Payne, No Gain” shirts also carried signs urging basketball recruit Adreian Payne to join the Mountaineers during Mountaineer Madness Friday.

Mountaineer Maniacs President Cassie Werner said her organization "in no way, knowingly" committed NCAA violations at Friday’s Mountaineer Madness event.

Reports surfaced Monday that the West Virginia University compliance department is reviewing possible NCAA secondary violations that were committed at the event involving basketball recruit Adreian Payne.

"I would never want to break a rule, and I would never want to get the University in any type of trouble," Werner said. "If we broke a rule, I’d like to know what it is.

"I honestly have to plead ignorance because I honestly don’t know a rule that we broke."

Assistant Athletic Director for Compliance Patrick Hairston told The Charleston Daily Mail Monday the situation is currently under review.

Calls to Hairston and Compliance Director Chad Wall were not returned.

The Maniacs handed out T-shirts that read "House of Payne" and "No Payne, No Gain" before the event and made signs directed toward Payne, encouraging him to commit to WVU.

The possible violation mainly concerns whether the T-shirts bought by the Maniacs would be considered a University purchase.

NCAA rules state a university cannot organize anything to help publicize a recruit’s presence.

But the Maniacs is a private organization that is only recognized by the University, not an entity of it, according to Werner.

She said the money came directly out of the Maniacs’ membership funds and the individual, non-profit organization, receives no money from the University.

Werner said, after learning of Payne’s plan to attend Mountaineer Madness, she and a group of friends took it upon themselves to organize the display and no other parties were involved.

"Nobody asked us to do it. At no point in time did someone approach me and say ‘Hey Cassie, you should get the Maniacs to do this,’" Werner said. "We took it upon ourselves. It was just a group of friends who love Mountaineer athletics, and we thought it was a very appropriate thing to do.

"There was a top 25 recruit coming to town. We can’t just not do something."

Werner said she feels the highly organized display is the main reason for the investigation. While the Maniacs have done similar events in the past to welcome a recruit, it has never been as detailed, according to the president.

"It was so organized, and there were so many people involved and I think that’s why it’s under question," Werner said. "No one ever came to us when we did things like this in the past and tell us that we can’t recognize a recruit."

Werner said she has spoken with "all the necessary channels" in order to help clear the situation.

 

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27 comments

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Central Virginia WVU Supporter
Sun Nov 1 2009 20:27
This is a regrettable incident which might have been prevented by closer attention to and monitoring Maniac activities by the Athletic Department. NCAA rules have become so convoluted and difficult to interpret that it is completely plausible that the Maniacs were not aware their actions might be a potential problem. I've know trained attorneys to have widely differing opinions about their interpretation.

Season ticket holders are routinely provided written materials which caution against activities on their parts which might adversely effect WVU. Perhaps prudence requiere that that the designated leaders of all student organizations having any direct or indirect association with Mountaineer Athletics receive intensive cautionary briefings on the topics of activities that might violate NCAA regulations. These probably should be delivered by the compliance officer at least yearly.

UK u S UK
Fri Oct 23 2009 14:36
If your a Kentucky fan what the hell are you doing on the West Virginia Website, afraid your program isn't as good as ours at the moment? Because your conference certainly isnt
Scott
Thu Oct 22 2009 15:09
Chill out guys, don't let the UK crazies get you in a tizzie. Huggy, I'm sure, knows the recruiting rules very well by now. I'm if there was anything serious going on at madness, it would have been stopped by the coaching staff or athletic department.
due dilligence
Thu Oct 22 2009 10:16
NCAA Bylaw 13.02.13 defines a "representative of the institution's athletics interests" as an individual, independent agency, corporate entity (e.g., apparel or equipment manufacturer) or other organization who is known (or who should have been known) by a member of the institution's executive or athletics administration to:

Have participated in or to be a member of an agency or organization promoting the institution's intercollegiate athletics program;

Have made financial contributions to the athletics department or to an athletics booster organization of that institution;

Be assisting or to have been requested (by the athletics department staff) to assist in the recruitment of prospective student-athletes;

Be assisting or to have assisted in providing benefits to enrolled student-athletes or their families; or
Have been involved otherwise in promoting the institution's athletics program.

The Maniacs are the "official student booster group for Mountaineer athletics" or so says WVU press releases. Our own basketball media guide calls them a booster group.

christos
Thu Oct 22 2009 10:16
Isn't the difference in seriousness between what WVU did and other schools, that they gave direct attention to where the recruits were at their Madness? They may as well had them on the floor.
MtnDew
Thu Oct 22 2009 09:39
Someone pull up the rule that says Maniacs can't do this. That's because there is no rule. The Mountaineer Maniacs are technically not part of WVU. They are only "recognized" by the university. It's the exception to the rule. No violation will be handed out to anyone! Don't you think the coaches would've taken down the signs and shirts if it was a violation? They know the rules because you saw them stop Truck. They knew that nothing can happen because it was the maniacs doing and there's no rule against that. people need to stop saying how this is a big "no no" when they actually have no idea of the exact rule.
Your name
Thu Oct 22 2009 08:15
Not knowing the rules is NOT an excuse. I think however she is lying and did know the rules....she just chose to do it anyway with the idea that a "secondary violation" would be the worst outcome.
Your name
Thu Oct 22 2009 07:40
Are you kidding me? How could she not know this was a violation? To Werner's point of not being a "university entity" their own website points to the contrary - "The Mountaineer Maniacs are part of the Student Government Association, and are supervised by the Division of Student Affairs." I'm pretty sure SGA and the Division of Student Affairs who are responsible for "supervision" are both WVU entities.
mike tyson
Thu Oct 22 2009 02:57
The player gained nothing at all because of this. He didn't personally gain from this at all so it shouldn't be an issue.

The only people at all who are making a scene are those from other school who want him. They think if they cry loud enough about something that really doesn't matter, disciplinary actions will take place.

Your name
Thu Oct 22 2009 01:27
first of all UK fans and more to the point the Compliance Dept at UK know better than to do this at an event much less ESPN Madness... In fact you cant do it period... Do I think the rule is stupid Yes to a point. Do I think that the Maniacs should have known better...ABSOLUTELY!!! If they are a type of booster, and if they love their Mountaineers so much (which is cool) then they should know the things they should not do so they dont hinder the recruiting of their team (not cool).
Kudos for the effort. Stupid in not knowin' better in the first place....and on ESPN? Seriously...
And yeah there is a huge difference in chanting a players name and having a section of Payne dedicated groupies.
Your name
Wed Oct 21 2009 22:54
Who cares, we know Paynes coming here now anyway. Wait a week and this will all blow over.
Are You Kidding???
Wed Oct 21 2009 22:37
The University didn't stop this and it is their job to keep order, they let the signs come in, they let them wear the shirts. Their mascot even put up one of the signs...come on...its one thing to chant the name of a recruit but what they did was a clear violation and WVU should not be allowed to recruit this kid because of this.
smitch
Wed Oct 21 2009 22:03
I agree whole-heartedly that it's a very stupid rule and hard to enforce and I'm not out for blood, wanting WVU penalized or to lose any recruits, but if the rule is going to remain on the books the schools should be held responsible for curbing fan action as best they can. If they let this slide, then just get rid of the rule, make it open-season and let the fanbases get creative.
Bill
Wed Oct 21 2009 21:50
It seems like a stupid rule, but its a slippery slope argument. If there were no rules prohibiting conduct like this could you imagine what would go on?
Your name
Wed Oct 21 2009 21:43
The concept is ridiculous to begin with that students can't get excited about recruits. But, if there is a rule and the NCAA doesn't enforce it, as in this very blatant violation by WVU, then all programs should be allowed to do similar and the rule discarded now and in the future. Otherwise, this is a completly unfair advantage that WVU was just provided pertaining to Payne who is being recruited by several programs who did not break the rule in such an overt manner. Since this rule is in effect, the only fair thing would be for Payne to not be allowed to go to WVU as similar decisions by the NCAA have occurred before.
Poetax
Wed Oct 21 2009 21:32
Kentucky did lose a recruit one time when the players took him to Louisville for a Derby party. The reason was the trip was outside the mileage limit by a few miles and thats not allowed. The penalty was UK could not recruit the kid and he ended up signing with Louisville if that was irony. But the point is alot of NCAA rules are pointless and stupid. Its like the celebration penalty in football, what is that all about?
smitch
Wed Oct 21 2009 21:16
I can understand Cassie & Co. not knowing the rules, but where WVU might find its butt in a sling is the non-action of the compliance department. Yes there were some chants at UK's BBM, but they were muted compared to past years mainly because the UK compliance dept. sent out releases to fan boards and other mdeia outlets saying the chants were a violation. If anyone tries to put up a sigh about a recruit too, the UK staff has it taekn down.

That the posters and t-shirts were made is not that big of a deal. That the WVU compliance dept & athletic dept did so little to curb it is problematic. If the mascot (or band or other WVU-associated members) participated then it gets even more serious.

Cassie can plead ignorance, the compliance and athletic departments cannot. For them, ignorance is no defense. It's called "lack of institutional control".

Your name
Wed Oct 21 2009 21:13
The fact that one of the players held up one of the signs to the crowd couldn't help.
david
Wed Oct 21 2009 19:30
making posters and T-shirts with the name and picture of the recruit on them are a huge no-no, then having your team mascot parade the signs around the gym is blatantly against the rules... this goes well beyond just chanting a recruits name (impossible to control) that was done at the other schools mentioned above.
Your name
Wed Oct 21 2009 19:23
Anyone that thinks this stuff happens at Kentucky is Ludacris. Do you not understand the spotlight that falls on UK basketball? We had a small handful of fans chant a recruits name and that was it... no signs, no t-shirts, nothing to that effect, and we got torched for it.

Wearing T-Shirts and having the student body recognize a recruit like that is DEFINITELY a recruiting violation. Especially since the University could have stopped it from happening and did nothing. You can not have your student body organize a mass display in order to sway a recruit.

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